GOP may target gay rights measures - Coeur d'Alene Press: Local News

GOP may target gay rights measures

North Idaho Republicans want to make city rules unenforceable

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Posted: Friday, June 14, 2013 12:00 am | Updated: 12:05 am, Fri Jun 14, 2013.

COEUR d'ALENE - Cities' anti-discrimination laws aren't sitting well with the Republican Party.

Neither is daylight savings time, Common Core standards or Obamacare - or 27 other issues, for that matter.

So Saturday, the Idaho Republican Party Central Committee will consider two resolutions that call for the legislature to enact a law that would render any municipal anti-discrimination law unenforceable.

GOP central committees in Bonner County and Idaho County have submitted the nearly identical resolutions for state committee adoption.

Bonner County's reads:

" ... the Bonner County Republican Central Committee recommends that our legislators support Idaho's current anti-discrimination laws and policies, and enact a law that would make unenforceable any municipal ordinances that would seek to expand categories of prohibited discrimination beyond current state anti-discrimination laws and policies."

Idaho cities that have adopted such ordinances include Boise, Sandpoint, Ketchum, Moscow, Coeur d'Alene and Pocatello.

The state central committee will meet for its summer session in McCall today through Saturday. They will discuss a number of rule changes and 31 resolutions outlining the party's stance on a number of issues ranging from anti-discrimination to ending daylight savings time.

Bjorn Handeen, a Kootenai County state committeeman, sits on the state central committee's resolution committee. He said that committee will debate each of the resolutions and decide which to recommend for adoption by the state party.

"Still, I would imagine that anything we pass will have little to no effect anyway," he said, adding that passage of a resolution carries as much weight as making an official statement.

However, he said, if the anti-discrimination resolutions are passed the party will send a letter to the legislature requesting the legislation.

"We would find such a bill a real tragedy," said Tony Stewart, a member of the Kootenai County Task Force on Human Relations, which has been encouraging local governments to adopt anti-bias ordinances. "Our hope is that our legislature would not support such legislation."

Stewart said the task force believes that no citizen should be a second-class citizen, and that no American should be denied such vital services as a job or an apartment based on discrimination.

"This is a fundamental issue of democracy," Stewart said.

He believes passage of the resolution by the state party would be sending the wrong message to the rest of the country.

"It could even cause a boycott of conferences to the state," he said.

Handeen said he is not sure if the resolutions will pass the full committee or not, and even then he doubts the legislature would take any action in that area.

"We make a lot of effort at the grassroots level, but in the end we have very little impact," he said. "There are a lot of discouraged people who put in the effort on these issues, but we rarely see any results."

Handeen said 50 years from now when Chinese historians are researching why America allowed itself to fall and asking themselves why nobody did anything, he will have a clear conscience.

"They will see that in 2013, North Idaho actually did try to do something," he said.

Other resolutions to be considered include tax issues, reversing Common Core standards, ending the caucuses in lieu of primaries, protecting the second amendment, opposing the implementation of Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and transferring federal lands to state ownership.

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78 comments:

  • Ziggy posted at 12:59 pm on Tue, Jun 18, 2013.

    Ziggy Posts: 1107

    In anthrpology dept we understood the concept of "other." I remember explaining to a friend of mine from Georgia that blacks that I grew up with in the Spokane area were just like average kids. We partied, hung out together, went to lunch, went to the lake. But he grew up in a southern mountain town where the blacks lived on one side and the whites on the other. Thus, the fear of "other."
    Same with gays and straights. I have had gay and straight friends all my life. What do we do? We go shopping, go to lunch, go to parties, go to the lake, play card games. What the sexual orientation of my friends and aquaintances is should make no difference at all unless I want to marry one of them and then I would probably have to find out. Otherwise, it makes no difference at all. The thing is, all the people who are so afraid of gays are meeting them every day. They are your postman, the meter reader, the professor, the lawyer, the farmer, the football player, the soldier, the secretary. It's just that we don't wear the "S" or the "G" tatooed on our forehead. You already know the people you are so afraid of; they are your friends and neighbors.
    But my kids just don't understand all this fear against gays. Among their group of friends from the private college they attended, are both gays and straights. And it just isn't an issue with them so yes, Mahiun is correct, the tide is changing in favor of tolerance, just like it did back in the 60s and 70s for blacks. And young people are leading the way. The CdA City Council did the right thing.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 1:52 pm on Mon, Jun 17, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    I understand what you're saying, Joe, but it does carry a couple of biiiiiiig problems, for me:

    [*] Nobody ever got their rights by asking politely for them, and waiting meekly in the corner for the privileged class to decide that was okay. Sometimes, it really does come down to being persistent enough and "in yer face" enough that the Powers That Be agree to give you what you should have had all along, just to get you to leave them alone!

    [*] Asking you (in the sense of "all of you") for my rights implies that they are yours to either grant or deny. But they're not --- they're rights, and rights, by definition, are not subject to popular vote.

    [*] I'm not a young man, as you can see. We have made incredible strides in my lifetime, but I don't have a great deal of lifetime left, and I want to see us reach the "Promised Land" while I'm still alive. I feel like I can't afford to "just let things lie" --- it's too important, and we're too close. And, frankly, if we constantly wait for a "right time", there will never be a "right time" --- at least, no time more "right" than "right NOW.

    As the saying goes: "If not us, who? If not now, when?"

    So all I ask is that you educate yourself on this subject and keep an open mind --- just admit that it's possible you may have gotten it wrong. Yes, even with regard to the Bible. Check out this video, which very carefully goes through every single one of the 6 standard "clobber verses" typically used in anti-GLBT campaigns. You may change your mind, you may not ---- but at the very least, you'll come away knowing a whole lot more about these Bible passages than you ever knew before! (WARNING: this is a sermon, and it's kind of long [about an hour], so get something to eat and drink and just settle in for an hour.)
    http://www.upworthy.com/every-biblical-argument-against-being-gay-debunked-biblically

     
  • Humanist posted at 12:16 pm on Mon, Jun 17, 2013.

    Humanist Posts: 2997

    Hi Joe D. Here is a great example of why all anti-LGBT haters arguments sound so devoid of logic and reason. Including yours.

    https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/1001047_570120326371593_1247544380_n.jpg

     
  • Joe D posted at 11:53 am on Mon, Jun 17, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Mahiun, great answers, and polite. Thank you. I also went to school in Cd'A. First thru eighth grade at St. Thomas Catholic elementary. Ninth grade at IHM, I'm sure you know of that one. The tenth grade I attended the high school on 15th street, then part of 11th grade at the Cd'A High on fourth st. I would have graduated in 1974 but had bigger and (better?) things to do. I probably know you. Good luck with your cause, because I think your going to need it. No bad feelings here,I hope the same there. Just some advice. let things calm down, forcing an issue like this does not help your cause. But don't expect me to change my mind and don't think of me as ignorant because of my beliefs and difference of opinion Fair enough?

     
  • Mahiun posted at 9:54 am on Mon, Jun 17, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    Joe D
    Mahiun, OK next questions. Why do you like wasting your time and energy on a mission that will fail?<?i>
    Because I don't think it will. I don't think it has. Even if I never get the truly hardcore to change their minds, I've forced a conversation to take place, I've forced people to deal with the issue instead of just ignoring it or sweeping it under the rug or pretending it doesn't really exist. That's a win --- a small win, but a win, nonetheless.

    And I think it will only grow, from there. They may not say so, on here, but someone somewhere is going to read these discussions and decide that there really is no good reason to avoid, dislike, fear, or discriminate against GLBT folks. Someone, somewhere will change their mind and start to really think about why they've always believed what they've always believed, and whether it might be time to question what they've always been taught. Someone, somewhere will realize that GLBT people are just that: people, with pretty much the same hopes, dreams, goals, fears, and day-to-day lives as everybody else, and deserving of the same kind of respect, dignity, and equality as everyone else.

    And finally, the fact is that things are headed my direction, Joe, not yours. The latest polling by ABC News finds that 58% of Americans now support marriage equality. And an HRC poll finds that a whopping 73% of Americans support exactly the kind of GLBT-supportive anti-discrimination laws that the City of Coeur d'Alene just put in place --- except that they want it at the federal level.

    So, it's not wasted effort, Joe. It's a long war, and I'm aware I'll lose a few battles --- maybe more than a few. But I'm not the only soldier, and sooner or later, we'll win this war. We're in it for the long haul....

    Did you go to school in the Coeur d'Alene area?
    Not even the area --- I went to school in Coeur d'Alene --- SD 271.

    If that is your picture you use here, you look to be in your fifties.
    Spot on --- good eyes, or good guess! :-)

    Where and what year did you graduate.
    CHS --- rather not say which year. (I already feel old enough; don't remind me.... LOL)

    According to you Idaho ranks 49th in per pupil education investment.
    Well, it's not according to me, it's according to the Census Bureau.

    So how did you manage to get so smart?
    I wanted it --- I wanted it badly enough to really work at it, not just while I was going to school here, but after I graduated. I wanted it enough to work my årse off in college and grad school. I wanted it badly enough to grab every learning opportunity I could find --- and afford!

    And that's why it's important that Idaho's education investment is so miserable. We are setting up our kids for.....well, not "failure" necessarily, but a much tougher row to hoe. The kids who go on to college are at a disadvantage in competing for admissions, and may need more "catching up" than kids from other areas --- and that is horrendously expensive. The kids who do not go on to college are ill-prepared for jobs anywhere else, and that's just not realistic in this day and age; the jobs they're qualified for are not likely to last and they will need to be able to adapt and learn new things, over and over, throughout their lives. Idaho's education system is letting them down, in that regard.

    And how did you as a homosexual survive in Idaho? I mean we are all such a bunch of heathens here.
    It ain't easy!

    But mostly, what I see is that an awful lot of people are operating on fear --- fear based on an incredible amount of old wives' tales, waaaaaaaaaay outdated (mis)information, or flat-out falsehoods. Well, that is frustrating for me but I can live with it, because ignorance itself is simply a "not knowing", and is easily fixed just by providing the missing information.

    What's harder to deal with is willful ignorance, and this also happens a lot. An attitude of, "This does not agree with what I've always heard and always believed --- therefore, it's wrong and I flatly refuse to even consider it!" While I understand that it can be difficult and uncomfortable to try to reconcile what you've always heard with new information, and it can be really, really tough to have to change your mind and admit that your beliefs may have been wrong, simply dismissing new info, out of hand, is not the way to go. It doesn't serve anybody well -- you, me, or anybody else, least of all the community as a whole.

     
  • Joe D posted at 8:47 am on Mon, Jun 17, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Mahiun, OK next questions. Why do you like wasting your time and energy on a mission that will fail? Did you go to school in the Coeur d'Alene area? If that is your picture you use here, you look to be in your fifties. Where and what year did you graduate. According to you Idaho ranks 49th in per pupil education investment. So how did you manage to get so smart? And how did you as a homosexual survive in Idaho? I mean we are all such a bunch of heathens here.

     
  • Joe D posted at 8:05 pm on Sun, Jun 16, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Are you sure about that jmowreader? You might want to recheck what you want to believe.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 12:53 pm on Sun, Jun 16, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    It is, at the very least, odd that the Idaho Republican Party -- ostensibly very pro-business -- would take a position that would encourage companies to locate in neighbouring Oregon or Washington, both of which have state-wide anti-discrimination laws that include protection for sexual orientation and gender identity. It's almost as if they're determined to drive business out of Idaho and into those other two states....

    It's also odd that no one has mentioned that very small "Mom & Pop" businesses with 5 or fewer regular employees, and religious organizations, are exempt under these city-level ordinances.

    Likewise, it's odd that there's been no discussion of the fact that many people in Cd'A could already sue their employer for sexual orientation discrimination, if they were of a mind to, because they work for large companies with a corporate-level anti-discrimination policy that includes sexual orientation and gender identity. Yet we don't read of this happening in Cd'A or Pocatello or Boise or Moscow or Sandpoint, even though it certainly could happen. It raises the question of why the Idaho Republicans (and others) believe it will suddenly become a problem with city-level ordinances?

     
  • Joe D posted at 11:51 am on Sun, Jun 16, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Ziggy, you are right, I was way out of line with that comment. I am sorry, it will not happen again.

     
  • Ziggy posted at 11:01 am on Sun, Jun 16, 2013.

    Ziggy Posts: 1107

    Well you can always hope so but I see a bunch of college educated bright young kids who are WORKING and enjhoying life. I think the days of the tired old angry white guys are over except in Texas and Alaska.
    And Joe D--saying someone is full of excrement is childish and out of place.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 8:48 am on Sun, Jun 16, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    So, Mahiun, If Idaho is such a horrible place to be, what are you doing here?
    [A] Being Idaho-born-n-bred, I can still remember when Idaho was "live and let live", when it still had great senators like Frank Church instead of embarrassments like Captain Closeted and Mike Crapo (pronounced exactly the way it looks), when it was not the laughingstock of the nation and the punch line of tacky (if deserved) jokes. Idaho could still be capable of great things, but it will take hard work and dedication to pull it out of its 1947 time warp and into the 21ty century.

    [B] Nowhere else are people like me needed quite so badly.

    [C] The fact, and the amount, that people like irritate the holy #^%@$& out of people like you (and Niles, and Ratty, and....) tells me that I'm on the right track and doing exactly what needs to be done, where it needs to be done.

    Yeah, I could just leave it alone and let you wallow in your homophobic complacency while I take it easy in some gay-friendly "bubble", but that really wouldn't do much to solve the problem long-term, would it? It wouldn't improve things a lot for those who would still be stuck in Idaho because they're too young and/or too poor to leave.

    Next question, please....

     
  • concernedcitizen posted at 8:10 am on Sun, Jun 16, 2013.

    concernedcitizen Posts: 2530

    Actually Ziggy, I think the youth of those that moved here are being indoctrinated into the I don't want to work, I don't have to work, the government will provide for me, there is no wrong, I can do what ever the government makes a law for, progressive BULL----!

     
  • Screen Name posted at 8:01 am on Sun, Jun 16, 2013.

    Screen Name Posts: 735

    Don't confuse and Idaho conservative with facts...That might cause them to actually consider engaging in rational thought and discussion. A very difficult undertaking for those with underdeveloped cognitive resources.

     
  • max power posted at 7:39 am on Sun, Jun 16, 2013.

    max power Posts: 559

    *** Looks Like Jmowreader Is Drinking The Kool-Aid ***

    California budget surplus is "projected" surplus. Projections are rarely met in the Land of Fruits & Nuts. If they do end up with a surplus perhaps they can put it against the 850 billion to 1.1 trillion dollar "off the books" unfunded liabilities the state has incurred.

     
  • Joe D posted at 11:18 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Mahiun, my backside is something you or no other f@%%#t talks about.

     
  • Joe D posted at 10:49 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    And Ziggy, I think you're full of excrement...

     
  • Joe D posted at 10:43 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Well good for you, you must be one of those old white gays.

     
  • Ziggy posted at 8:45 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Ziggy Posts: 1107

    I am encouraged by the last hospital and school board election. Also what I've noticed is that the old white guy conservatives who moved here in the last twenty years are being outnumbered by the new younger people moving in who are much more enlightened.
    I think the Republican party is annhilating itself.
    By the way, Joe, I was born right here in the Inland Empire some time before you came here.

     
  • Joe D posted at 8:39 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    I'm sure all you queens are going to go away mad. But that's OK by me. Have a nice trip. And like I said, never have called myself Joe Idaho or Idaho guy just Joe D. I'll make those two dudes seem pleasant.

     
  • Ziggy posted at 7:51 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Ziggy Posts: 1107

    I'm guessing either JoeIdaho or Idahoguy is back as Joe D spewing the silly stuff that Fox News puts out to all those who mindlessly follow. Thus, the anger.
    To all who moved here and tried to change us--a bunch of old white guys. Our college educated kids say the Repubs have nothing to offer anyone under the age of 65. So true. Looks like it doesn' it.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 7:21 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    And behold, the Idaho GOP standeth on the shores of Payette Lake, saying unto them:

    Homogays are still an 'abomination', but pork, shellfish, mixed-fibre clothing, cross-breeding of animals, hybridizing seeds, tattoos, touching pigskin, and shaving are now allowed."
    --Republiconnians 8:3

     
  • Joe D posted at 6:23 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Why don't you go take a long walk off a tall cliff Mahiun and take all your buddies with you. And no, I won't be going first.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 5:48 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    Oh you have, Joey, you have! You've made it crystal clear that it's only your sensibilities and your values and your ideas about the way the world oughta work and your preferences and your life that counts for diddly-squat, and the all the rest of us can just go &*($%^# ourselves. Yeah, you've made that reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeal clear, Joey!

    So now, let me be completely clear: Pull on your Big Girl Panties, deal with it, and grow the &*($%@# up, Baby Boy! It's not all about you!

     
  • Joe D posted at 5:31 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Mahiun, Because I am sick and tired of all the bovine excrement ya'll are shoveling around. If you would have left this issue alone, I would have been alright with it. Like I have said before, I do not care what you do, but now y'all have got me just a little ticked off. If they want to get married, go to a state where it is legal. If they want to be in a scouting program, start their own, if you do not like N. Idaho, move. Just stop shoving your way of life down everyones throats and wanting special rights. In the past few weeks, y'all have done your cause a lot more harm than good. You should quit while you're ahead. I hope I've made myself crystal clear to you and everyone else.

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 5:14 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    Yes, DeNiles, you would be among them (the whiners ).

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 5:12 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    Guessing this is Joe Idaho back in another name. Makes the nastiness make sense. *Proud to be a liberal*

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 5:11 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    What's beyond me is how you could possibly think an employer can't hire who they want to. I guess you haven't heard of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 ?

     
  • jmowreader posted at 3:03 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    jmowreader Posts: 1137

    Joe D, California is running a budget surplus right now.

     
  • CMartel2 posted at 2:56 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    CMartel2 Posts: 11

    "As well as their fight against women's and monority rights."

    Hmmm. The abolishment of slavery, the Civil Rights Act of 1965, and women's suffrage were all movements pushed through by Republicans. What "rights" are you referring to? The only rights our nation recognizes are those guaranteed by God and through our constitution.

    Or is this another pretend "belief" that is plucked off of some liberal wishlist?

     
  • CMartel2 posted at 2:49 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    CMartel2 Posts: 11

    "The only thing this law would be is mean spirited"

    No, I disagree. These laws are frequently used as a battering ram to discriminate against religious business owners who want to hire employees with value systems that mirror their own. Why an employer shouldn't have that prerogative when they are the ones taking capital risks and assuming control of the success and mission of their company is beyond me.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 2:46 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    What crawled up your back end and died, Joe? Why so nasty?

     
  • Mahiun posted at 2:42 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    Idaho's overall crime rate is in the bottom 10, that's true. Its HIV stats are not quite as impressive, as the data is skewed by the extremely small sample size (a very rural state with a comparatively low population, with stats measured "per 100,000 population" gives very skewed results that are extremely difficult to compare against more populous states).

    But that misses the point, as does your discussion of spending. That's great, that Idaho's overall crime rate and HIV infection rates are as low as they are --- but again, that completely misses the point. The point was (and is) that there are plenty of critical issues facing Idaho, that need immediate and focused attention and action. Whether or not some poor gay guy or lesbian might actually catch a break with their employer or landlord would not seem to really rise to the level of "high priority", when there are so many other areas of much more critical importance to the well-being of the state of Idaho....

    So, Niles, is "chronically missing the point" something you were born with, or is it simply your chosen lifestyle?

     
  • Joe D posted at 2:41 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    I doubt it, will.

     
  • Joe D posted at 12:19 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Wow! All the 75 or so liberals in the area are making a stand. Ain't that special...

     
  • Joe D posted at 12:03 pm on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    So, Mahiun, If Idaho is such a horrible place to be, what are you doing here? I'm sure your presence and knowledge would be much appreciated in the ULTRA-LIBERAL BANKRUPT state of California to help them solve all of their problems.

     
  • DeNiles posted at 10:50 am on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    DeNiles Posts: 2450

    Idaho has one of the lowest crime rates and ranks among the lowest in number of gunplay deaths. The rate of death by AIDS in Idaho is miniscule.

    There are states which spend more and get a lot less and there are states that spend less and do better. Of course some prefer to just spend and do not worry what they get for their dollars. Some people get paid relatively well who could perform better and choose not to. Some people do their best regardless of what they earn. Some people are just whiners.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 8:52 am on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    Idaho ranks 49th in per-pupil education investment, 47th in post-secondary college enrollment, dead last for brëast cancer screenings (51/51), 49th in number of physicians per capita, dead last in number of mental health professionals per capita, 7th highest for melanoma, 11th highest for suicide rate, 42nd for average wage, and 18th highest increase in families on food stamps.

    But at least the Idaho Republicans can go to sleep each night knowing that some poor schmuck in Coeur d'Alene, who they don't know and will never meet, can still lose his job and his apartment, for being seen kissing the wrong person or coming out of the wrong place, and it won't happen on Daylight Saving Time --- first things first!

     
  • yourneighbor posted at 7:49 am on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    yourneighbor Posts: 234

    I think Humanist is....Take a look at the comments. It really is the same old song and dance.

     
  • The Simple Truth posted at 6:11 am on Sat, Jun 15, 2013.

    The Simple Truth Posts: 563

    I applaud the GOP for taking this stance. As well as their fights against minority and women's rights. They will all contribute to the destruction of the GOP and that cannot happen soon enough.

     
  • Joe D posted at 9:48 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Ziggy, I would like to add one more thing for you think about. Back in the days before you were born, there were conservative democrats. It was when the democratic party started being taken over by progressive liberals like yourself, that the party went downhill. That information might get your panties in a wad, but it is what it is.

     
  • Joe D posted at 9:26 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Ziggy, The keyword you used is WAS,
    I'm glad the conservatives are in charge now so Idaho will not get run into the ground like Cali did. And FYI I have lived in CDA sense I was 6 years old, that was 51 years ago. Why should I get run out by a bunch of invaders like you? This is the and always has been a conservative state. And it always will be. So get use to it...

     
  • will-- posted at 8:52 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    will-- Posts: 885

    ""This is a fundamental issue of democracy," Stewart said.

    He believes passage of the resolution by the state party would be sending the wrong message to the rest of the country.

    "It could even cause a boycott of conferences to the state," he said."

    How comical! I'm sure the state of Idaho will be really disappointed if the homosexuals decide to boycott and go elsewhere.

     
  • ancientemplar posted at 8:47 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    ancientemplar Posts: 1139

    Ziggy, you're smokin' somethin'. You're forgettin' about all the LDS in the South of Idaho. You don't have a chance. Move along.

     
  • Ziggy posted at 7:47 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Ziggy Posts: 1107

    Not true. We do NOT live in a conservative state. This state was solidly Democratic up until the great influx from the southern state. However, we are still here. The moderates, progressives, moderate Republicans. We are here and we can outvote the radical right if we get out and vote.
    However, we all need to get out and vote.
    And, Joe, you would best be movin' on to Sarah Palin Territory. Much more suited to your beliefs.

     
  • Joe D posted at 6:29 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Joe D Posts: 2500

    Gee boys and girls, that didn't last very long did it. Face it, you live in a conservative town in a conservative state. Get use to it or move along. What I do not understand,is why all of you gays and lesbeians are here in Idaho, a place that you will never get your way no matter how much you scream and holler. When you could be in a city like San Francisco, the land of homosexual milk and honey...

     
  • miles1 posted at 5:42 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    miles1 Posts: 94

    This sounds exactly like Colorado's Amendment 2, which the U.S. Supreme Court struck down in 1996. The Idaho GOP should read Romer v. Evans 517 U.S. 620 (1996).

     
  • The Golden Mean posted at 5:28 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    The Golden Mean Posts: 4213

    North Idaho Republicans want to make city rules unenforceable

    In other words, chaos and anarchy should fix everything?

     
  • Mahiun posted at 5:20 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    There at many times that the most qualified applicant is not the best applicant for a position.
    "Many" times?? Don't you think that might be pushing it, Niles? "Many", really?!

    There is such a thing as over qualified for a job.
    Mmmmmmmmaybe --- but there are plenty of employment and recruitment experts who say otherwise. "Overqualified" is often just a mask for age discrimination, or a slightly more polite way of saying, "We don't want to pay you what you're actually worth," or, "You intimidate me." Highly qualified individuals drive change and improvement, and should be valued as bringing talent, experience, drive, and know-how to the company. Companies should be looking to exhibit the kind of flexibility that allows them to make use of that kind of talent, especially when it is interested in working for your company.

    The try to avoid new hires they feel may be accepting the position as stop gap employment. New employees are expensive. When a new hire bonus is offered they typically do not pay that bonus on the hire date. They pay it a year or more after the hire date. They want their new hire to fill the job well and for long enough to warrant the expenses of bringing them on board.
    This is all perfectly true, but it's also all perfectly unrelated to the sexual orientation of the employee in question.

    Of course if you happen to be gay you can now bring untold misery upon any business you choose, just about at will.
    As you could if you were straight. Or female. Or male. Or Christian. Or non-Christian. Or Italian. Or Chinese. Or too dark-skinned. Or too light-skinned. Or any of a whole host of characteristics, but only if that were the reason you were not hired/promoted/retained, and you can prove that to a jury, beyond a reasonable doubt. Otherwise, all you'd get for your efforts would be blacklisted within your career field, a humiliating loss, and a whopping debt from owing not only your own court costs and legal fees but the other side's, as well!

    And this relates back to all the hand-wringing, gnashing of teeth, and rending of garments amid the prophecies of doom and a plethora of lawsuits just "because they can". But if that were the case, we should already have seen it happening, because a fair number of Coeur d'Alene residents (presumably including GLBT residents) already work for companies with non-discrimination policies that include GLBT. And that means that there many managers in town who, given their druthers, might not hire or work with GLBT persons. But they don't have their druthers about it, they have learned to live with it or find another job where they have their druthers that way, and life goes on. We have not seen this slew of lawsuits that all the naysayers claim is the inevitable result of the mere ability to file suit. That ability already existed for a fair number of people (and all the ordinance does is extend it to the rest of Cd'A residents; why did we not see this onslaught of litigation "because they can"?

    We didn't see them for exactly the reason I laid out earlier: such suits are very expensive for the losing side, so if you're going to file one, you need to be very sure that your side will prevail. You need to have concrete and irrefutable evidence of discrimination --- dates, times, places, names, and particulars --- and not merely a vague sense of discomfort and not merely j'accuse with nothing more to back it up. These suits are not filed simply because people had nothing better to do....

    Why sue a bakery because they did not want to bake your wedding cake?
    Because [a] they have committed what you believe to be illegal discrimination and you believe they should not be able to get away with it, [b] because you and/or your spouse have been subjected to humiliation and emotional distress, unnecessarily and illegally and you believe they should not be able to get away with it, [c] because you believe that no one else should have to endure the same kind of humiliation and emotional distress, [d] because a suing and winning sends a message that no one is above the law, simply because they don't agree with it.

    Simply patronize those businesses that welcome your business.
    In less populous areas, this is not always a practical option. Nor should it be necessary. It is the latter-day equivalent of "No Coloreds Served Here".

    Or you can raise the biggest smelliest stink possible.
    Change, growth, and betterment of society don't happen by meekly sitting in a corner and accepting the status quo....

    All Americans already have these rights.
    No, they don't. And therein lies the problem.....

    Now the LGBT have more specified rights than others.
    No, they don't. The law says "sexual orientation"; it does not specify any one sexual orientation. If you are fired for being straight, you have just as much cause for action as any gay or lesbian person would!

    But you know that neither you nor anyone you know would have any real risk of being fired for your own sexual orientation. And as long as it doesn't affect you, then all's right with the world, and who cares who it does affect, right?!

    In fact, anyone not getting their dream job should just claim to be gay and bring on the attorneys.
    That would be an extremely foolish thing to do --- see above RE: expenses for the losing side....

    Let the harassing begin.
    Oh, I thought you'd been doing that for quite some time, now.... You mean you're planning even worse??!

     
  • slfisher posted at 4:19 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    slfisher Posts: 32

    This would would be the party of local control?

     
  • Humanist posted at 2:56 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Humanist Posts: 2997

    Actually no. I've just always found posts like yours hypocritical.

     
  • chilada01 posted at 2:40 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    chilada01 Posts: 159

    Taking something personal?

     
  • Ziggy posted at 1:49 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Ziggy Posts: 1107

    Something interesting happened in CdA in the last election. The moderates won! The Flat Earthers got kicked off the school board and did NOT make any inroads into the Kootenai Medical Board. People finally got fed up enough to get out and VOTE.
    We are stil here, the moderates, progressives, Democrats, and sensible Republicans. You are right. Everyone gave up, but this last vote shows that if we all get mad enough, we can rid ourselves of the extremists who would brand our state as a place where discrimination reigns supreme.
    It can be done if people just get out and vote.

     
  • Born in Bonners posted at 1:14 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Born in Bonners Posts: 69

    We need to vote these Republican buffoons out of office. I quit voting in general elections because only uncontested Republicans were on the ballot. Didn't seem to make any sense to me. When I moved back here my first trip to city hall was to vote and I couldn't believe there wasn't one Democrat on the ballot so I wrote in my own candidates, people I knew were Democrats. Bring back Cecil Andrus. This state has become an embarrassment. All these wingnuts came from Southern California to shove their ideology down our throats. I was born and raised here and my parents taught me tolerance. I can't stand what this state has become because of these people. Vote them out. They're mentally ill.

     
  • Screen Name posted at 1:00 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Screen Name Posts: 735

    "...who would possibly be in favour of INjustice?!"

    The GOP.

     
  • Ziggy posted at 12:50 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Ziggy Posts: 1107

    Wow! That's all CdA needs: a law rejecting anti-discrimination laws. CdA already suffers from the stain of Butler. This would seal Kootenai County's fate as a place where discrimination is practiced and welcomed. How stupid. I would think the hotel/motel owners, colleges and all enlightened employers would try to talk some sense into the Flat Earther Party.

     
  • COG777 posted at 12:19 pm on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    COG777 Posts: 338

    Very cute RM but I don't think there were anymore dinosaurs in the days of Sodom and Gomorrah.

     
  • Mark on the Park posted at 11:56 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Mark on the Park Posts: 471

    Gosh, I remember that being proclaimed in the 60's (Kennedy), 70's (Watergate), and 90's (Clinton).

    But I'm sure you're right.

     
  • Humanist posted at 11:34 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Humanist Posts: 2997

    chilada01 posting "Same folks same comments in 3, 2, 1......" in 3, 2, 1...........

     
  • DeNiles posted at 11:25 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    DeNiles Posts: 2450

    There at many times that the most qualified applicant is not the best applicant for a position. There is such a thing as over qualified for a job. The employer is seeking to hire a person capable of doing the work and somebody satisfied with the position. The try to avoid new hires they feel may be accepting the position as stop gap employment. New employees are expensive. When a new hire bonus is offered they typically do not pay that bonus on the hire date. They pay it a year or more after the hire date. They want their new hire to fill the job well and for long enough to warrant the expenses of bringing them on board.

    Of course if you happen to be gay you can now bring untold misery upon any business you choose, just about at will. We see this type of vindictiveness in many such lawsuits. Why sue a bakery because they did not want to bake your wedding cake? I would not want them baking the wedding cake I plan to serve my guests. Simply patronize those businesses that welcome your business. Or you can raise the biggest smelliest stink possible.

    And this is what is wrong with this type of specified legislation. All Americans already have these rights. Now the LGBT have more specified rights than others. In fact, anyone not getting their dream job should just claim to be gay and bring on the attorneys. It is nothing but a foundation for legal harassment. Let the harassing begin.

     
  • Cody Wiench posted at 11:20 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Cody Wiench Posts: 349

    You must be pretty amazing if you have multiple jobs offers and can pick your boss and job. Maybe you haven't heard, but many people don't exactly like their bosses. A job is a necessity; one shouldn't have to worry about who is and who isn't going to discriminate against them (solely based on being gay).

     
  • Cody Wiench posted at 11:18 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Cody Wiench Posts: 349

    The only thing this law would be is mean spirited. I don't know if it applies, but the Supreme court struck down a similar proposal in Colorado partially on the basis that it was driven by "animus".

    Big business has realized that discrimination does not work. NOT discriminating against gays does not equate to discriminating against Christians.


     
  • Mahiun posted at 10:43 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    I thought the Idaho GOP was all about local control.
    They are! They're all about local control --- of everybody else!

    So the Pocatello GOP wants to be able to control Pocatello --- and Moscow, Nampa, Lewiston, Twin Falls, Rexburg....

    And the Coeur d'Alene GOP wants to be able to control Coeur d'Alene --- and Caldwell, Gooding, Boise, Idaho Falls....

     
  • The Golden Mean posted at 10:09 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    The Golden Mean Posts: 4213

    Re: "Handeen said 50 years from now when Chinese historians are researching why America allowed itself to fall and asking themselves why nobody did anything, he will have a clear conscience"

    Clearly, the GOP had to borrow trillions of dollars from China because of Gay Rights. That is why America has fallen. Yes, we must protect this country from gay rights, because of what the Chinese historians might say 50 years from now.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 9:29 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Mahiun Posts: 4827

    That's really an excellent explanation, and a great example of professionalism in the workplace! Thanks for that; it really is genuinely appreciated.

    And that's an extremely important element to remember in all of this: it's not just "Oh, you didn't get the job and you happen to be gay" --- that's happened to me plenty of times, and you dust yourself off and move on to the next opportunity. Somebody else fit the qualifications a little better. Oh well; life goes on.

    It's when you are clearly the best-qualified person for the job, and it becomes clear that you didn't get the job because you're gay. Or straight. Or a woman. Or black. Or Jewish. And so on.

    That's the important part: when you meet or exceed the stated job qualifications, or when you meet or exceed performance standards on the job, the job you're applying for goes to someone less qualified, and you can demonstrate, document, and prove beyond a reasonable doubt (which is much more difficult than it sounds, and not something undertaken frivolously!) that it was because of your sexual orientation.

    And yes, that can and does happen. It has happened to me; I have been fired for being gay, and it happened to my late partner, too --- and one of his co-workers went so far as to throw a Bible at him and hit him in the back of the head, as he was leaving his workplace with his belongings, after being fired.

    The really insidious part, though, is that up to now, it has not even needed to be your actual sexual orientation --- it could simply be whatever your employer thought it was. That was enough, and not a thing you could do about it. If you --- a straight guy --- accepted your gay friend's invitation to go out for a beer with him at his favourite watering hole (which might be a gay or gay-friendly pub) and were seen coming out of that place, your boss could fire you for being gay, even though you aren't! That's why the ordinance says "real or perceived".

    No, you don't have to like your boss to do the job. It would be nice, but it's not really necessary. And sometimes, it's the job itself that you want, despite the &*($%^# in the manager's chair. The job may be exactly the right "next step" in your career path, and it is a simple matter of fairness and justice. I truly don't understand why treating people fairly and equitably should be so controversial --- who would possibly be in favour of INjustice?!

     
  • Triumph posted at 9:19 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Triumph Posts: 540

    I appreciate the comment acid. I don't see it the same way. If I were gay and my employer hated gay people but didnt know I was gay, I'd still move on to a different employer. I agree with you that having disagreements on issues is common and it's certianly ok to disagree. But if a person was prejudice against me (even if he didnt know I was who he hated) I would not associate with him. I think the law states that if an employer doesn't hire someone because they are gay or so called trans gender they are in violation of criminal law. I don't think it only pertains to firing people.

     
  • acid posted at 8:54 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    acid Posts: 45

    The most qualified person for the job gets hired. The anti-discrimination ordinance comes in when the employer fires the person down the road after he/she discovers that said persons sexual orientation. That is discrimination. Just as if the employer made unwanted sexual advances on an employee and then fired them because they turned them down, sexual discrimination. I've learned over the years that you don't have to like someone to work with them. It's called being professional. It's called respecting someone and agreeing to disagree. I love my mother but we have agreed to disagree on a few issues and have done this for years. It's when you don't or won't respect someone's stance that you can't work with/for them.

     
  • DCIDAHO posted at 8:35 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    DCIDAHO Posts: 2065

    Be afraid. If all the Democratic party has to throw at the next election is Clinton or Christy, we could be in for a giant leap backward in social evolution.

     
  • Triumph posted at 8:07 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Triumph Posts: 540

    I have a question. Maybe someone can help me understand... If I were gay, and I applied for work somewhere and the manager or owner happend to not like me because I was gay, would I want him to have to hire me? I would think that I would not want to work for that dude. You can force someone by law to hire a person, but you can't force them to like them or approve of their lifestyle, race, religion, gender....... I wouldn't want to work for someone who didnt like me for how I believe.

     
  • mister d posted at 7:58 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    mister d Posts: 1531

    Foolish move.. Every day there is more reason to dump the Idaho Republican party - I have. Hopefully the Democrats and Independents will pull up some quality candidates to move Idaho forward.

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 7:55 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    Republicans seem to be living in a time warp. Dinosaurs.

     
  • hayden_guy posted at 7:44 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    hayden_guy Posts: 399

    "You've confused the war on your religion with not always getting everything you want. It's called being part of a society."

     
  • ancientemplar posted at 7:38 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    ancientemplar Posts: 1139

    Stewart said the task force believes that no citizen should be a second-class citizen, and that no American should be denied such vital services as a job or an apartment based on discrimination.

    On the other hand many have just been made a second class citizens, subservient to the LGBT crowd by being denied the right to employ whom they wish and to direct their businesses in a fashion of their choosing, according to their faith.

     
  • acid posted at 7:35 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    acid Posts: 45

    Oh good, just when I was starting to feel good that Idaho wasn't going to do a time leap back to 1950's. So now you want to take away the rights of cities ans counties to self govern, WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU!!!!!!!! I thought that is what YOU stood for!!!!! PULL you heads out of your A** and say hello to 2013 where we all have to work together!!!! I used to vote republican untill you guys decided to look to the church for your next candidate. When you put religion in charge of politics you have the Taliban. The only difference between Islam and Christianity is the book that they read from. Both will find the words they need to insite hate and distane for anyone they don't like. They will find the word they need to justify ANY action they see fit

     
  • hayden_guy posted at 7:33 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    hayden_guy Posts: 399

    I thought the Idaho GOP was all about local control. Guess that is only the case when it fits their agenda.

     
  • Miketeague posted at 7:25 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Miketeague Posts: 1966

    Boy the republicans really have it easy, first you don’t have to vote anymore, the party hierarchy will decide for you, and then they will stop that bothersome problem of cities and local governments governing themselves. You know I’ve heard of this before I just can’t put my finger on where.

     
  • wheels1 posted at 7:10 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    wheels1 Posts: 389

    Many things don't sit to well with Republicans these days.

     
  • Good_Ole_Mitt_Romney posted at 6:54 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    Good_Ole_Mitt_Romney Posts: 147

    Old Backward Republicans.The most misguided, arrogant bunch of old men. They are a bygone political force that wilts slowly away . Bury the party in 2014 and 2016. Bob Dole was right shut it down and re-group.

     
  • chilada01 posted at 6:29 am on Fri, Jun 14, 2013.

    chilada01 Posts: 159

    Same folks same comments in 3, 2, 1......

     
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