If our founding fathers could see us now, what would they think of their country? - Coeur d'Alene Press: Local News

If our founding fathers could see us now, what would they think of their country?

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44 comments:

  • RadRevD posted at 11:31 pm on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    brilliant comment T-T...
    wish I could have thought that one up before you did.

    ( http://hottestnewsnow.info/patch-picks-five-independence-day-facts/?amp )

     
  • The Truth posted at 7:55 pm on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    The Truth Posts: 2193

    The freedom on which this country was founded is not the just freedom for the thoughts we love and agree with, it's freedom for the thoughts we hate the most. That too is a cost of freedom which must be paid by everyone...

     
  • fun gal posted at 7:06 pm on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    fun gal Posts: 259

    I think they might be ashamed that Corporate America runs the country instead of "We the People"......
    Yellow Press makes a strong point regarding Hemp. Both George and Thomas grew hemp. Not solely for smoking but for "Industrious" purposes. Hemp was a BIG crop back then, one year crop turn around, whole plant usage. If you do your research, you'll find that in the beginning of the 20th century, the BIG TIMBER BARONS, did not like this. They lobbied congress to "Criminalize" Hemp because of the intoxicating factors. BS. They really wanted industry to move toward timber production so THEY (timber barons) could get rich. And .......WA-LA....done. Corporate timber barons.....

    Canada and China know the benefits of hemp production. We need to back to this. MOST AMERICANS do not understand the THOUSANDS of products that can be made from hemp. Food, clothing, building materials. Cheap crop, one year turn around.

    30 years for a tree.

     
  • RadRevD posted at 4:12 pm on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    The USA has already been obsolesced.
    We are little more than a dumping ground for slave labor goods made poorly.

     
  • The Golden Mean posted at 3:43 pm on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    The Golden Mean Posts: 4213

    “...just another Progressive revisionist scam upon liberty.”

    Or have the old school revolutionaries become complacent, becoming that which our “founding fathers” rebelled against in the first place? Have those who cried “foul” in the face of forward thinking not violated the intent of liberty itself?

    COG might not be the right word, but it is the first word that comes to mind.

    Change must remain a constant and those who support stagnation must be challenged regularly or we will, as a country, become obsolete.


    Ps: Where are this generation’s angry teenagers? Maybe iPhone has an app for that.

     
  • RadRevD posted at 12:30 pm on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    btw...just another Progressive revisionist scam upon liberty.

     
  • RadRevD posted at 11:58 am on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    to Mahiun posted at 9:26 am on Mon, Jul 4, 2011...

    The mandated health care insurance applied only to merchant marine.

    ( http://prospect.org/csnc/blogs/tapped_archive?month=01&year=2011&base_name=john_adams_and_the_affordable )

    In July of 1798, Congress passed – and President John Adams signed -"An Act for the Relief of Sick and Disabled Seamen." The law authorized the creation of a government operated marine hospital service and mandated that privately employed sailors be required to purchase health care insurance.
    Keep in mind that the 5th Congress did not really need to struggle over the intentions of the drafters of the Constitutions in creating this Act as many of its members were the drafters of the Constitution.

    And when the Bill came to the desk of President John Adams for signature, I think it’s safe to assume that the man in that chair had a pretty good grasp on what the framers had in mind.

    The following law sounds like the beginning of workman's compensation that employers are required to carry on their employees.

    "
    Wth July,1798. CHAP. [94.] An act for the relief of sick and disabled seamen.1 § 1. Be it enacted, Sfc. That from and after the first day of September next, the master or owner of every ship or vessel of the United States, arriving from a foreign port into any port of the United States, shall, before such ship or vessel shall be admitted to an entry, render to the collector a true account of the number of seamen that shall have been employed on board such vessel since she was last entered at any port in the United States, and shall pay, to the said collector, at the rate of twenty cents per month for every seaman so employed ; which sum he is hereby authorized to retain out of the wages of such seamen. § 2. That from and after the first day of September next, no collector shall grant to any ship or vessel whose enrollment or license for carrying on the coasting trade has expired, a new enrollment or license, before the master of such ship or vessel shall first render a true account to the collector, of the number of seamen, and the time they have severally been employed on board such ship or vessel, during the continuance of the license which has so expired, and pay to such collector twenty cents per month for every month such seamen have been severally employed as aforesaid ; which sum the said master is hereby authorized to retain out of the wages of such seamen. And if any such master shall render a false account of the number of men, and the length of time they have severally been employed, as is herein required, he shall forfeit and pay one hundred dollars. § 3. That it shall be the duty of the several collectors to make a quarterly return of the sums collected by them, respectively, by virtue of this act, to the secretary of the treasury ; and the president of the United States is hereby authorized, out of the same, to provide for the temporary relief and maintenance of sick, or disabled seamen, in the hospitals or other proper institutions now established in the several ports of the United States, or in ports where no such institutions exist, then in such other manner as he shall direct:Provided, that the moneys collected in any one district, shall be expended within the same. §4. That if any surplus shall remain of the moneys to be collected by virtue of this act, after defraying the expense of such temporary relief and support, that the same, together with such private donations as may be made for that purpose, (which the president is hereby authorized to receive,) shall be invested in the stock of the United States, under the direction of the president; and when, in his opinion, a sufficient fund shall be accumulated, he is hereby authorized to purchase or receive cessions or donations of ground or buildings, in the name of the United States, and to cause buildings, when necessary, to be erected as hospitals for the accommodation of sick and disabled seamen. § 5. That the president of the United States be, and he is hereby, authorized to nominate and appoint, in such ports of the United States as he may think proper, one or more persons, to be called directors of the marine hospital of the United States, whose duty it shall be to direct the expenditure of the fund assigned for their respective ports, according to the third section of this act; to provide for the accommodation of sick and disabled seamen, under such general 1 Curtis, George Tickner. A Treatise on the Rights and Duties of Merchant Seamen, According to the General Maritime Law, and the Statutes of the United States. (Boston: Charles C. Little and James Brown, 1841), 407-409
    instructions as shall be given by the president of the United States for that purpose, and also, subject to the like general instructions, to direct and govern such hospitals, as the president may direct to be built in the respective ports : and that the said directors shall hold their offices during the pleasure of the president, who is authorized to fill up all vacancies that may be occasioned by the death or removal of any of the persons so to be appointed. And the said directors shall render an account of the moneys received and expended by them, once in every quarter of a year, to the secretary of the treasury, or such other person as the president shall direct; but no other allowance or compensation shall be made to the said directors, except the payment of such expenses as they may incur in the actual discharge of the duties required by this act.[Approved, July 16, 1798.]"

     
  • RadRevD posted at 9:45 am on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    Mahiun...that is why I avoid Progressives an Evolutionists!
    They are either confident they know geologic fact, OR
    they change the facts to accommodate their presupposition that God IS NOT.

    It's one thing to be a deluded COG, quite another to be an Obamanating Deceiver.

    btw...can I land one of those $278K jobs???
    I really don't have the patience to contend on the $100K Ladder.

     
  • The Truth posted at 9:43 am on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    The Truth Posts: 2193

    The freedom on which this country was founded is not the just freedom for the thoughts we love and agree with, it's freedom for the thoughts we hate the most. That too is a cost of freedom which must be paid by everyone.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 6:49 am on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    Mahiun Posts: 5194

    "Seek the company of those who seek truth, and shun those who claim to have found it." --Anonymous

     
  • The Golden Mean posted at 12:00 am on Tue, Jul 5, 2011.

    The Golden Mean Posts: 4213

    “There are many truths. Not just THE TRUTH”

    The Book of the Grotesque

    “That in the beginning when the world was young there were a great many thoughts but no such thing as a truth. Man made the truths himself and each truth was a composite of a great many vague thoughts. All about in the world were the truths and they were all beautiful.

    The old man had listed hundreds of the truths in his book. I will not try to tell you of all of them. There was the truth of virginity and the truth of passion, the truth of wealth and of poverty, of thrift and of profligacy, of carelessness and abandon. Hundreds and hundreds were the truths and they were all beautiful.

    And then the people came along. Each as he appeared snatched up one of the truths and some who were quite strong snatched up a dozen of them.

    It was the truths that made the people grotesques. The old man had quite an elaborate theory concerning the matter. It was his notion that the moment one of the people took one of the truths to himself, called it his truth, and tried to live his life by it, he became a grotesque and the truth he embraced became a falsehood.”

    Sherwood Anderson, Winesburg, Ohio 1919

     
  • RadRevD posted at 10:15 pm on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    no T-T, racists fail to recognize the sovereignty of Gad and the abject despair of man.

     
  • The Truth posted at 6:48 pm on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    The Truth Posts: 2193

    "Isn't racism just an evolved inbred trait"

    I would agree that racists are, by definition, hopelessly inbred.

     
  • yarply posted at 4:34 pm on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    yarply Posts: 492

    Sorta like Bevus and Butthead

     
  • RadRevD posted at 4:08 pm on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    It's easy to make an imbecile laugh.

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 3:24 pm on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    LOL GM !

    @yarpley.....yes you did take the point to an illogical conclusion. Congrats. I guess.

    @RadRev......There are many truths. Not just THE TRUTH. I doubt you will ever get that.

     
  • The Golden Mean posted at 12:11 pm on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    The Golden Mean Posts: 4213

    "If people really believe in evolution, then isn't racism normal..."

    Well, that's all the time we have today for... Bomb Shelter Deductions From Space!


    Tune in next week when a talking snake, a nude woman and an apple wreck paradise for all mankind.

     
  • The Golden Mean posted at 12:06 pm on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    The Golden Mean Posts: 4213

    "These people come from all walks of life and each has a true story..."

    In the Twighlight Zone.

     
  • yarply posted at 10:00 am on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    yarply Posts: 492

    None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.

    Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

     
  • RadRevD posted at 9:45 am on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    Mahiun...

    COGs are not far from the Company Store</i.
    Recall my earlier posts that Russell called for two classes of citizens.
    Well actually three, the third being the class he was privileged to.

    Exploitation? Like that 'B U M' is going to buy a cheap mobile home under current status quo!
    If they stay away from West Sherman Ave, they can almost do what they want.
    The Beautiful Gentry, MayorB, and Mikey are revulsed by Aqualung!

    more later...

     
  • yarply posted at 9:33 am on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    yarply Posts: 492

    Or illogical.

     
  • yarply posted at 9:32 am on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    yarply Posts: 492

    Isn't racism just an evolved inbred trait in which most normal people as a whole exhibit in their quest to pass on their genes to the next generation and to further their species or race. If people really believe in evolution, then isn't racism normal, and part of the great battle of the fittest? Take your logic to its logical conclusion.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 9:26 am on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    Mahiun Posts: 5194

    Rev, you started off okay there, actually had a couple of interesting points to make, but then you really kind of derailed a bit and the central point became rather muddled....

    Why work when they earn more with an extended hand?
    This is one of those "interesting points", but maybe not in the way you intended. This actually probably says more about work than about that extended hand. And what it has to say is not kind, because it seems to say that there is something terribly wrong with a system in which honest work pays so little. It says "exploitation", which is not exactly flattering to the work world....

    I know a couple people right now that would only need another body slam to put them on skid row.
    Sadly, that has become true for most of America. Nearly all of us are much closer to financial ruin than we believe; all it would take is an unexpected catastrophic medical expense or auto accident. (And that's not just me saying that, this is statistical fact: the overwhelming majority of American personal bankruptcies are because of medical expenses, often associated with auto accidents.)

    And this did, in fact, concern the founding fathers enough, on two fronts, that they felt it necessary to confront both of those fronts. Bills of attainder were common throughout England at the time, with the debts of one family member creating havoc for relations, up to and including debtor's prison. America's founding fathers specifically wanted to ensure that this would not be the case for Americans.

    But the founding fathers were also concerned enough with health, health care, and health car insurance to mandate, by federal law, the purchase of individual health insurance. That's right: the individual mandate contained in the Patient Protection and Affordable Health Care Act is NOT the first time this country has had federally mandated individual health insurance. It was signed into law under President John Adams, having been passed by a Congress containing many of those same "founding fathers" we often hear invoked by people claiming they would never support such an idea. Well.....they would and they did. And as many of them were responsible for drafting the constitution, it's probably safe to assume that they had a pretty good idea of the "founding fathers' intent" and whether or not it was intended to be constitutional.

    Finding a wife is a good thing...
    Finding a spouse is a good thing!

    ...he came to understand that it is FAMILY that provides real support and love.
    Very true. But "family" doesn't always consist of the people you're related to. Sometimes you have to create your own family of people who love you and whom you love in return. It's not the DNA that makes the family, it's the love and caring.

    And with that: Happy commemoration of certain treasonous acts committed against the King's Majesty, His Royal Highness George III, on 4th July 1776. ;-)

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 8:10 am on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    @ Nutter.......I'm glad you thought about it and looked carefully at what I was saying to you. Happy 4th of July

     
  • RadRevD posted at 8:05 am on Mon, Jul 4, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    to Nutter Watch...

    Forget the adjective, try an internationally renowned name: Aqualung.
    The word 'B u m' is apt for those who have fallen through the cracks.
    Why work when they earn more with an extended hand? Who would hire them anyway?

    These people come from all walks of life and each has a true story.
    I know a couple people right now that would only need another body slam to put them on skid row.
    One endured extensive exposure to Xenol and other solvents that continue to impact his nerves.

    I would go mobile were it not for my wife and her encouragement.
    Ecclesiastes 4:10 - If one falls down, his friend can help him up. But pity the man who falls and has no one to help him up! Finding a wife is a good thing, especially when she is a gift from God.

    As for that falling though the cracks thing,,,Dear Abby last week contained a letter from an inmate who made a wrong choice to support his Hommie. Behind bars he came to understand that it is FAMILY that provides real support and love. He will spend years paying for his crime. Will he be successful restoring FAMILY TIES once released? OR, will he be shuffled through parole boards, counseling with the likes of Randy, and eventually give up.

    The Assemblies of God had a good program going in years past called TEEN CHALLENGE. It wasn't just for teens. The program offered meals and a warm bed, life counseling, and opportunity to serve the community or a fellowship while sharing their stories. Nikki Cruz was the most notable successes and continues to evangelize internationally.

    The Founders would be shocked by the wealth redistribution that is ongoing with no effect. Consider how much it costs to equip and maintain an office, the counselor's salary, utilities, vehicle, support staff,
    an accountant, clinical liaisons, and so much more. Which 'B u m' has the cash to pay for even one appointment? Why would they even waste the time, except to get at Uncle Barry's rewards! Is that process better labeled 'vote-buying'? How many walk-ins do Licensed Clinical Professional Counselors receive in a given month or year for that matter? I dare say that the greater majority of the cases are court or employer mandated. Our current treatment modality may be the greatest boondoggle ever....but it keeps the Progressives in power.

    Many counselors and ministers get their kicks and affirm their inflated self-esteem by knowing they are superior to their clients. Only by sharing the transforming love of Christ can a life be truly changed.
    It remains my hope that the Randys of this world will embrace the Truth and cease to be part of the problem.

     
  • Nutter Watch posted at 8:59 pm on Sun, Jul 3, 2011.

    Nutter Watch Posts: 476

    "@ Nutter...........I think you really don't see the racism and prejudice in what you are saying."..........

    I suppose racism, like beauty, rests in the eye of the beholder. Words like "racism", "homophobia" and "xenophobia" are valued by liberals for their, although greatly diminished, power to shock and signal an end to political discourse when facts and logic regarding human nature begin giving the politically corrected a headache. The premise was, what if the Founders returned today. One would think they would return with the same biases, prejudices and world view they carried when they exited this vale of tears as DeNiles so brilliantly pointed out, and would express the greatest curiosity in those things that were relevant to them in their time and place.

    "Try to think how a person of color might be offended.".......................
    Those cities I mention have unemployment rates in excess of 40% for African-Americans---how do you think that makes them feel? We're talking priorities here.

    "Now to your Sherman example. Bums ? Really ? Do you see the stereotyping there as well? Doesn't matter the skin".....

    Bums may have been excessive. I do apologize for any offense taken by those who consider themselves self-respecting "bums"--Freddie the Freeloader comes first to mind. Although a recent story in the CDA Press of a shiftless (you fill in the blank) panhandling a nine year old girl on east Sherman leaves me searching for a printable adjective. I'm open to suggestions here.

    "Do you see the stereotyping there as well? Doesn't matter the skin tone......it is what you are saying about them."............................

    For a stereotype to endure it must contain an element of truth.

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 6:34 pm on Sun, Jul 3, 2011.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    @ Nutter...........I think you really don't see the racism and prejudice in what you are saying. It does not excuse it though. I know you are a bright individual from your posts. Think about what you said. Try to think how a person of color might be offended. Now to your Sherman example. Bums ? Really ? Do you see the stereotyping there as well? Doesn't matter the skin tone...it is what you are saying about them.

    @RadRev......I am in the private sector employment wise. You are the one who is trying to or is collecting disability. Let me guess...back injury ? Every time you open your mouth on here you stick your mouth in it. Just where are you employed ? Opps...huh ?

     
  • The Golden Mean posted at 2:12 pm on Sun, Jul 3, 2011.

    The Golden Mean Posts: 4213

    ”If our founding fathers could see us now, what would they think of their country?”

    That doesn’t matter right now. I want to know who brought them back from dead and why.

     
  • yellow press posted at 12:22 pm on Sun, Jul 3, 2011.

    yellow press Posts: 89

    Our founding fathers were state citizens ... today that Union which they created is dead. Our founding fathers had "rights". Today we have no rights ... just privileges. Today we are citizens of a federal corporation known as United States .. we are but modernized slaves, subject to and under jurisdiction of said UNITED STATES. UNITED STATES citizenship was ushered in by the 14th amendment which was enacted to give newly freed "negros" UNTIED STATES citizenship, while the rest of the population at the time was composed of state citizens of independent states, which together formed a perfect union known as The United States of America. Entitlements and welfare were soon offered by this newly formed corporation, those who accepted anything from the UNITED STATES were unknowingly entering themselves into "voluntary servitude" of the corporation, becoming subject to and under jurisdiction of said corporation. As most all of us have birth certificates, we each also have a legal faction/corporation created in our names, which reflects the recent ruling that corporations are persons ... persons are corporations. If your birth name is John Smith ... as your birth certificate application says, then the Department of Treasury creates a legal faction/corporation/person known as JOHN SMITH, of which you are legally consenting to being known as. The Department of Treasury then borrows money from the IMF on your newly formed legal faction/corporation. Any time you receive anything from the US or its agents in the mail, notice that your name is in all capital letters, for this is the name of the legal faction in which you are consenting to being known as, as explained on the signature line of your checkbook, which is not a line, but a micro contract you are singing without your knowledge each time your write a check. Your signature is your endorsement and acknowledgment that you consent to being known as said legal faction. Along with the assumption of this legal faction as your identity, you assume new "privileges" in exchange for the rights guaranteed in the Bill of Rights, and the unalienable rights given to you by God. The Bill of Rights which was written for and applies only to state citizens, not citizens of the corporation known as the UNITED STATES. The Union created by our founding fathers was destroyed by international banking families via civil war, as a result of the rejection of Rothschild's First Bank in the United States of America by Andrew Jackson.

    So yeah .. this subject has little to do with ganja. The ganja comparison was only one of many examples of how you don't own your person, the corporation known as the UNITED STATES owns your person, which is why we cant smoke ganja without getting arrested in Idaho ... we don't own our bodies. They don't give a crud about our physical conditions, if they did, hamburgers would be illegal .. it is our minds that those who wish to control us fear. I highly doubt our founding fathers intended the inhabitants of the "free world" to be little more than free range chicken ... thinking they are free so they produce more, and fetch higher prices at market, yet still ultimately slaughtered for profit.

    www.state-citizen.org

     
  • RadRevD posted at 8:42 am on Sun, Jul 3, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    is this the necessary fix?
    ( http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=317705 )

    June 11, 2003, Rep. Vic Snyder, D-Ark., brought HJR 59. It was intended to "permit persons who are not natural born citizens of the United States, but who have been citizens of the United States for at least 35 years, to be eligible to hold the offices of president and vice president."

    Sept. 3, 2003, Rep. John Conyers, D-Mich., brought HJR67, which would have done the same as Snyder's, only the requirement to be a citizen was lowered to 20 years.

    Feb. 25, 2004, Sen. Don Nickles, R-Okla., brought S.B. 2128 to "try to counter the growing Democrat onslaught aimed at removing the natural born citizen requirement." But it defined NBC as someone who was born in and is subject to the United States," which was not the understanding of the framers of the Constitution.

    Sept. 15, 2004, Rep. Dana Rohrabacher, R-Calif., brought HJR 104, "to make eligible for the office of president a person who is not a natural born citizen of the United States but has been a United States citizen for at least 20 years."

    Jan. 4, 2005, Conyers, D-Mich., HJR2, the same as Rohrabacher's.

    Feb. 1, 2005, HJR15, Rohrabacher, to require only 20 years citizenship to be eligible for the office of president.

    April 14, 2005, Snyder, HJR42, requiring 35 years' citizenship.

    Feb. 28, 2008, Sen. Claire McCaskill, D-Mo., tried to attach to SB 2678, Children of Military Families Natural Born Citizen Act, an amendment clarifying what "natural-born citizen" includes. Obama and then-Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y., were sponsors.


    Throw that baby in the basket back to the Kenyan desert.
    The Founders never anticipated another Messiah!

     
  • DeNiles posted at 4:50 am on Sun, Jul 3, 2011.

    DeNiles Posts: 2450

    Well they had their own ideals and they practiced their own biases. They were not all mushy and forgiving souls. In many ways they fought to end foreign tyranny only to impose local tyranny. Those who opposed the person in the white house preferred states rights and when their own party ran the white house they preferred more national control. Politics was so dirty and unscrupulous then that the 1st Adams tried to control freedom of speech via the sedition acts in a contorted attempt to end fallacious campaigning. Today we simply call that 'spin'.

    In other words they had their own serious troubles some of which snowballed into major problems for this country. They were not the chaste icons some historians would have use believe. They may look at America today and chastise themselves for not running it better from the onset. In too many ironies they stumbled into establishing America. The things they got right were important. And it would seem that getting things right is a long lost art in todays leadership. In fact they've gotten it wrong so badly, for so long that we may not be able to fix it now.

     
  • RadRevD posted at 9:07 pm on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    Nutter...understand that Randy has final been strapped behind the plow dispensing BS at taxpayer expense. if the Fed & State downsize, Randy is out of a J.O.B.!

    It's time to end all entitlements! If a person will not work...they shall not eat!

    WHAT A FREAKIN MOTIVATOR!!!

     
  • Nutter Watch posted at 7:47 pm on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    Nutter Watch Posts: 476

    RM. Had I made reference to shiftless White bums down on east Sherman during the middle of the workday, would that have indicated a need for "education" about melanin challenged individuals here in NI?

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 7:02 pm on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    I can't believe Nutter referred to "idle Negroes" ...oh my. Apparently there IS still a need for education about people of color here in North Idaho.

    Back to the founding fathers and what they thought people would be like nowadays....I'm sure shocked and dismayed.

     
  • Nutter Watch posted at 1:46 pm on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    Nutter Watch Posts: 476

    If the nation's Founders were to return today, I rather suspect they would be far less concerned with prohibitions against production and consumption of cannabis and simply aghast at the sheer numbers of idle Negroes loitering about in cities such as Philadelphia, Williamsburg Va. and Charleston SC during the middle of the workday. Many of these men, after all, were slave owners. Washington, one of America's richest men himself, may have been the nation's first Republican President. Acting in typical hypocritical Republican fashion by sending federal troops into western Pennsylvania crushing protesting farmers for their refusal to pay taxes on homemade liquor while he was running a distillery at Mount Vernon, and no evidence exists that he was paying his share of taxes on spirits to help service the residual debt from the Revolutionary War. This first act of violent federalism on his part would later be used by another interventionist Republican President seventy years later in sending troops into Virginia ensuring civil war. Happy 4th of July.

     
  • Mahiun posted at 10:56 am on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    Mahiun Posts: 5194

    "Ashamed" isn't strong enough. "Appalled", maybe. "Horrified". "Dismayed". Remember, these were men who actually signed documents pledging even their property to preserve and protect their liberties and personal freedoms. I believe they would barely recognize what this nation has become: a country of greed and gluttony, where property and profit ARE the only "sacred liberties" considered worth protecting and preserving.

    And I believe any emotion they felt would go far, far beyond merely "ashamed"....

     
  • yellow press posted at 10:25 am on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    yellow press Posts: 89

    Nutterwatch ... Please enlighten us as to why cannabis called dope. If cannabis prevents the breakdown of spindle neurons, and the breakdown of spindle neurons leads to Alzheimer's, then one might understand why cannabis is prescribed to Alzheimer's patients ... because it preserves the mind and conscience. I am interested in your logical analysis thru comparison as to why exactly cannabis is often referred to as dope. Are you saying that George Washington is less than intelligent because he grew cannabis in his courtyard at Mt. Vernon and and smoked cannabis on a regular basis? Who is the dope here? Anyhow, back to the topic ... the country that we are today is simply not what is was intended to be by our founding fathers, furthermore, under current political circumstances the founding of this country would simply have not been possible.

     
  • Randy Myers posted at 8:19 am on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    Randy Myers Posts: 1635

    sooooo RadRev is a pot smoker...interesting.

    I think the founding fathers woukld be so blown away by our modern technology that it would seem an alien planet to them. Thus, I said they would be "proud." In terms of what direction our freedoms have taken and the issues we deal with I think they would be amazed. Proud/ No.

     
  • yarply posted at 8:18 am on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    yarply Posts: 492

    From the comments the question should have been, What were the founding fathers smoking when they founded this country? Must of been some killer stuff for them to have come up with that constitution they wrote.

     
  • RadRevD posted at 6:21 am on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    RadRevD Posts: 3333

    hemp is the antidote to a COGgy state of mind.
    Freneau likely toked as he revealed our Progressive enemies RULES FOR CHANGING...

     
  • somewhereinthemiddle posted at 6:10 am on Sat, Jul 2, 2011.

    somewhereinthemiddle Posts: 92

    Too funny, Nutter!

     
  • Nutter Watch posted at 3:24 pm on Fri, Jul 1, 2011.

    Nutter Watch Posts: 476

    It's called dope for a reason.

     
  • yellow press posted at 11:16 am on Fri, Jul 1, 2011.

    yellow press Posts: 89

    George Washington and Thomas Jefferson both grew cannabis and smoked it. Jefferson said, " “Some of my finest hours have been spent on the back of my veranda, smoking hemp and observing as far as the eye can see.” Jefferson drafted the Declaration of Independence on hemp paper. Ben Franklin owned a mill that made hemp paper. Madison, Monroe, and my favorite president, Stonewall Andrew Jackson, all smoked cannabis. Our first flag was made of hemp. “Two of my favorite things are sitting on my front porch smoking a pipe of sweet hemp, and playing my Hohner harmonica.” – Abraham Lincoln. If the DEA and the Patriot Act were around then, our founding fathers would have been served no-knock search warrants by revolution era swat teams brandishing peacemakers and stone mortars. All of their accomplices would have been arrested for conspiracy under the RICO Act, and their assets would have been seized under civil forfeiture laws and used to fund the never-ending yet always draconian Drug War. Today our founding fathers would be disgusted by the DEA and FDA's classification of cannabis and all non-thc bearing industrial hemp as a Schedule 1 narcotic with zero medicinal value... right next to heroin, while prozac, viagra, and oxycontin prescriptions flow from doctors offices like an endless river of Jonestown Kool-Aid. It is my belief that our founding fathers would be appalled by the annual incarceration of about eight hundred thousand or our countrymen for non-violent cannabis related offenses. They would roll over in their graves at the fact that we are forced to import the world's most agriculturally important crop, hemp, from our competitors, canada and china. They would roll at the fact that our forests are logged for the same pulp which we could get from hemp at a rate which is far more efficient than that of timber farming. They would roll at the fact that hemp is 10 times more efficient at producing ethanol than corn, yet our government still subsidizes corn farmers while imprisoning hemp farmers. They would roll at the fact that resins from hemp are safe for humans, while most of the plastics in our childrens' toys contain BPA which is inherent in petroleum based resins and dangerous to all forms of life. They would be disgusted that our Drug War, as started by Nixion under direction of the United Nations, via the Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs of 1961, was used to build military bases around the world in order to "eradicate cannabis". Our founding fathers would have most politicians these days hung for their treasonous assaults on principles which at one time served as the brick and mortar of this once great nation.

    Interpol diplomatic immunity, FISA amendment, NSPD 51/HSPD 20, freeway ricky ross, Bail outs/nationalization of 2009, Federal Reserve act of 1913, Tax Stamp Act of 1937, fractional reserve banking system, fiat currency controlled by international interests, elimination of the Union of the United States of America and creation of the federal corporation known as UNITED STATES(TITLE 28, PART VI, CHAPTER 176, SUBCHAPTER A > § 3002), ...list goes on and on = ASHAMED


     
  • The Golden Mean posted at 10:36 am on Fri, Jul 1, 2011.

    The Golden Mean Posts: 4213

    Oh the power of subjective answers to what if questions. Answers that will be argued as if fact.

    This is going to get weird.

     
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